Growing Your Show Through Listener Engagement | Jerry Potter

Most podcasters struggle to keep listeners engaged until the end and to take action after listening. Thankfully, there are steps hosts can take to change this! In this episode, Jerry Potter introduces a simple idea you can add to your next episode that will help your show grow. You'll learn how to keep listeners engaged longer, increase action-taking, and grow your audience, all without changing your podcast format or spending extra time creating new content. Get ready to grow your show faster with less effort!

MORE FROM THIS EPISODE: HTTPS://PODMATCH.COM/EP/362

Chapters

00:00 Identifying Podcasting Challenges
02:28 The Power of Modcasting
04:47 Introducing the TSL Module
06:13 Enhancing Engagement and Action
08:33 Leveraging Short Form Content
10:26 Creating Effective TSL Modules
12:50 Simplifying the TSL Workflow

Takeaways

We shouldn't wait for our show to grow; we need to grow it ourselves.
Downloads alone don't equate to listener engagement.
The TSL module can significantly increase episode retention.
Modcasting allows for strategic podcast design using modules.
The TSL module can be added to any existing podcast.
Enticing content at the end of episodes keeps listeners engaged.
Short form videos are essential for reaching new audiences.
Creating TSL modules can save time in content promotion.
Don't overthink the editing of short form video clips.
Keep the TSL module simple and relevant to the episode's topic.

MORE FROM THIS EPISODE: HTTPS://PODMATCH.COM/EP/362

🎁 Want 9 quick ways to level up as a podcast host, guest, or agency? Visit https://PodMatch.com/Free! (No signup required)

Chapters

• 0:00 Identifying Podcasting Challenges
• 2:28 The Power of Modcasting
• 4:47 Introducing the TSL Module
• 6:13 Enhancing Engagement and Action
• 8:33 Leveraging Short Form Content
• 10:26 Creating Effective TSL Modules
• 12:50 Simplifying the TSL Workflow

Transcript

We're gonna solve three of the biggest problems in podcasting right now. Problem number one, getting people to find our shows. Have you ever heard someone say, you just gotta start releasing podcast episodes and your audience will find you? Yet so many of us have published over a hundred episodes and never been recommended by Apple or had somebody with a big audience share our show. I don't think we should sit around and wait for our show to grow. We're gonna grow it ourselves.

The number two problem in podcasting that we're gonna solve right now is getting people to listen to our full shows. What's the podcast metric we hear about all the time? Downloads, right? I've got so many thousands of downloads, which is nice, but a download alone is like getting someone on your email list that never opens an email. That's pretty much worthless except for our ego maybe, makes us feel good, right? And while podcast analytics are getting better and better, unless your show is only one minute long,

The analytics that we have now for some hosts will show how many people played the episode for one minute. Those aren't very accurate either if your show is nine minutes or 20 minutes or 120 minutes. So we're gonna add something that can dramatically increase how much of our episodes people listen to. And the number three problem in podcasting that we're gonna solve right now is getting people to take action and engage. And if your podcast is for your business and part of a lead generation strategy, it's even more important.

As a listener, how often have you gotten near the end of the episode and you heard the host start recapping what was covered or thank the guests for being there and you immediately skip to the next episode in your podcast queue? After all, there's so many good shows that we wanna listen to, right? Or maybe you heard the host wrapping things up and start saying things like, if you wanna learn more about how to work with me and then you just shut it off completely. We're gonna solve that problem as well. So we have not growing, not getting people to listen all the way through.

and not getting people to take action. And if that sounds too good to be true, I welcome the skepticism. People usually are skeptic until they hear what I'm gonna share with you today. The beautiful thing is it's only gonna take one feature that you can add to your show, starting with your next episode, that can start fixing all three of these problems. Now, I do wanna warn you, it can be really easy to overcomplicate this after you hear it, but I'll tell you how to do it so that it is simple. So stay until the end for that.

So when my wife, Candy and I worked as professional radio personalities or radio presenters, as they're called in some parts of the world, we would build our daily shows out of modules. You may have heard the phrase segment more on TV coming up in our next segment. Well, we call them modules and our overall show was built out of these modules and each module helped us achieve a different goal. So we might have a segment or again, a module that might be designed to get people actively engaged.

Another module might be designed to get them to listen at a very specific time, like every morning at 7.15. Another module might be designed to attract a certain demographic. Another one to get them to listen longer. And so each module was strong on its own, but you've heard the idea of how the whole of something can be greater than the sum of its parts. That's the idea here. Together, the modules we use to build our show became a powerful show and brand, and they became more content on the air.

online and offline. So now we take this module-based approach to podcasting that we call Modcasting, a module-based podcast where we design shows with clients strategically out of these specific modules that work together to create powerful, more effective episodes. And I can't get into all the different module types today and what they do, but I am gonna tell you about our favorite module. And by the way, it's our favorite for a reason. You can tell the other modules we said that, we're not gonna be worried about them getting offended.

And it's our favorite not only because it solves these three huge problems with podcasting, but also because it can be added to any existing podcast without having to change anything else, okay? It's called the TSL module. And it was gonna go at the very end of your episodes. So what does TSL stand for? It does stand for something. In our radio ratings, our ratings were primarily based on two different metrics. One,

how many people listen. So there were 500,000 people a week that would hear the show. And then number two was how long they listened. That second metric was called time spent listening or TSL for short. So since one of the powerful things that this TSL module does that I'm about to tell you about is increase the amount of time someone spends listening to your podcast, we named it after that metric.

In its simplest form, the TSL module is an enticing piece of content that people who are already listening to the episode will really want to hear. Now, let me say that again, because it's important. It's one more thing at the end of your episode that will be really appealing to the person who's already listening. Because if it is, they'll keep listening to hear it, right? By doing this, the number of people who make it to the end of your episodes will go way up.

Now, if you're thinking like, well, what do mean by an enticing piece of content that would go there? If you're wondering what that would be, I'll give you some ideas in just a moment. But again, the key is that it's a piece of content related to the topic of the episode. So it appeals to the same person. You can imagine if you did a podcast episode about growing on Instagram and then tease that at the end, you were gonna give them some lawn care tips, right? Kind of a disconnect that wouldn't be very effective. Now I actually did this in a sense today. Did you catch it?

After I explained today's topic and the three problems we're gonna solve, I said, I do wanna warn you, it can be really easy to overcomplicate this, but I'll tell you how to do it so it's simple. So stay until the end for that. We all want things to be simple, right? So if by the end of this, you wanna add a TSL module to your podcast, you're gonna wanna know how to keep it simple. So that's how we're solving the first problem with this TSL module in our shows, is getting people to listen to the whole episode.

Okay, so that's problem number one that we're solving. What we're left with is solving the not growing problem and the not getting people take action problem. Let's talk about the action part next. If you're an entrepreneur like I am, that's probably the most important part of your entire show, yes? Because that's the part that grows your business. If your podcast isn't converting, it might be because you're saying the wrong things or any number of things, but.

It's very likely because people are shutting it off before you even get to the call to action. Hard to convert when people don't hear the thing you want them to do. So the TSL module solves that because right before your call to action, you're gonna tease the content that will be in this final module again, okay? Now there's no call to action in this, but imagine there was. I would say right before I went into it, I would say,

Do you see how adding a TSL module to your show can keep people listening longer, getting them to take action and grow your show? Now I wanna show you how to approach this as an easy, simple way that you can keep up with in just a moment. But first, then I would go into my call to action, which is the free masterclass or a free download or to book a call, whatever it might be. So many podcasts end every episode with their call to action.

And that's why we've unfortunately trained listeners to shut it off because they've already gotten what they came for. They've already gotten what you promised in the title and the opening of the show. But with a TSL module, you're basically promising them some more awesome value. So they'll usually keep listening as you give your call to action. So imagine, let's say this was a situation where I was telling you all about the TSL module and you were like, yes, I...

I gotta add this, this is gonna be great. And I said, by the way, we gotta keep it simple though, right? Let me tell you how to do that in just a second. Then I went into my call to action. You're more likely to listen to the call to action. So we're keeping people listening longer. We're getting them to listen to our call to action. Now, how the heck would this grow our audiences? Because the TSL module is designed to be turned into a short form video. So if you're not familiar, short form videos like YouTube shorts, Instagram and Facebook reels,

and TikToks are the only social media content designed to regularly reach people who don't already follow you. So they are one of the best ways to reach people who don't know what our show is yet. But if you're already recording new podcast episodes all the time, it's exhausting to turn around and then have to record a bunch of reels and shorts after you've already created the episodes. It's also exhausting and much less effective

to record an episode and then go back through and look for things that might be good social media clips. So with the TSL module, we're building it into the show. We're designing it to be a great piece of content on its own, and there's nothing more to record after that. So I don't know how much promotion you do for your podcast after you record it, but when I made this switch, it saved me so much time because again, I didn't have to keep recording more content to promote the show.

It was already done. Now for me personally, YouTube is my biggest platform, but over on Instagram, I have about 4,000 followers and I've had clips of my podcast as Instagram Reels reach over 30,000 people. That's over 25,000 people who didn't know who I was hearing about my podcast. And I didn't have to record any additional content or pay for ads or anything like that. So the TSL module will keep people listening longer.

get them to actually hear your call to action and grow your show. Now, let me give you three examples of what your TSL module might be. Then I'll share how to keep it simple in your workflow, okay? Remember, this can be as short as 30 to 60 seconds long, okay? You could have a TSL module, it was two, three, four minutes, but it's basically one more valuable thing that you can give your audience before the episode ends. So.

For example, it might be a juicy bonus tip that relates back to the problem that your business solves. So one of our podcast design clients is a time management expert. So anyone listening is looking to get more tips to get more done, right? So imagine you're her listener and you hear, I'm gonna share something that will take you five minutes a day that will save you a full hour each day. So stay till the end for that. You're gonna stay, right? Or,

Our calendar often fills up with things we don't wanna do, so I'm gonna share the exact words to turn something down without pissing anyone off. It even works on your boss, and I'll tell you in just a second. We're gonna keep listening, right? Another option could be an inspiring success story positioned as a strategy. So I love this one, it's a little more complex, but one of our clients works with real estate agents and refers to their success stories as breakthroughs. So he might say something like,

And I'll share how one agent got three listing appointments from a single Facebook post and two of them were people he didn't even know. So in his podcast, it doesn't always have to tie back to what the main episode was about because all his listeners are real estate agents. And so any real estate agent is going to want to hear that. So in some cases, it just needs to be really enticing to them if you have a very specific audience. And another simple idea for a TSL module is to answer a question related to the main episode topic

but not covered during your core content. This is what I use in my podcast, The Six Ways. For example, we did an episode called Six Ways Entrepreneurs Can Quickly Increase Their Visibility. And then at the end we did our, what we call the question of the week. And it was, I wanna talk about my business more, but I'm always worried about driving people away if I'm selling all the time. How can I balance between selling and everything else? Right? If you were looking to increase your visibility, that would probably be a concern.

Another episode was six ways to keep your clients paying longer. So the question of the week was, my expenses are going up, but I'm afraid if I raise my rates on my clients, they'll leave. How should I approach this? Everybody would love to raise their rates, right? And if you're trying to keep your clients around longer, that could be a very valid concern. So do you hear how the TSL module topic in each of those episodes would be very enticing to the person who clicked on the episode in the first place? Now, I can't stress this enough.

don't overcomplicate your TSL module. As promised, here are three tips to keep this workflow simple, okay? Number one, whenever possible, make the topic for your TSL module something you're gonna talk about anyway, just break it off to be its own piece with its own tease. So for example, if your episode is gonna be three ways or five ways to do such and such, well, just take one off and make it the extra thing that you do at the end. Or,

Maybe you were gonna talk about five ways to do something or you're gonna talk about how to do something and then you have a special tool that's a shortcut. Make that your TSL module. It's the easiest thing to do to make sure it's tied back to your core content is to break off something you were already gonna talk about anyway. Number two for keeping the workflow simple. When you write your bullet points or whatever you're gonna do to use for your TSL module, make sure you include a hook at the beginning and don't reference the rest of the episode. So you don't wanna say,

So as we mentioned earlier or anything like that, you just wanna give a strong hook for the TSO module because it needs to stand alone as a short form video later. You don't wanna have to go back and re-record something new. And then number three, for keeping this simple and streamlining the workflow, don't overthink the editing of the short form video clip, okay? If your TSO module is already under a minute long, the editing with the tools we have these days could literally be done in seconds. Our podcast is edited in Descript,

and we have a template that we apply that includes an onscreen hook and a really nice looking captions. So if we don't have to shorten it, like it's already under 60 seconds, it usually takes us less than 30 seconds to create the short form video. That is the TSL module from our Modcast marketing system. I hope you can add it to your show and let me know how it works.